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What's amazing to me is the wide diversity of stories, all with authentic-sounding sources.
Here are all the versions I have heard or found on the internet. Let me know if you have a different version. I'd love to see something in print.
As Jimmy points out, a round in the Civil war was a pre-packed load in paper of powder and a musket ball ready for muzzle-loading. If you know of a picture of one, I'll add it to this page (the 40rounds above are from well after the Civil War). As it is, forty rounds make a neat package of bullets no mater what style, and, many different types of rounds are packed in batches of forty...slips in a pocket fairly easily. I found many references to a basic load of forty rounds for rifles through tanks.
I remember during my stint that the order went out that we were to say "40 rounds Sir" as we saluted officers. In my warped mind, "40 rounds" was pretty silly, made no sense, and was about the same as saying "beeble-beeble." So, in fact, it pleased me to salute officers and say, in effect, "Beeble-beeble, Sir". I'd salute with a smile. The statute of limitation is over now so don't come after me. 40rounds was also our tired response to snafu in general. Dinner will be late? , 40 rounds!
Dave Worden found the image to the left. - click on it to see the full size image.
Bill
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1. Bill Bliss
My memory is close to sources 5 and 6 below. I remember being handed a printed version of the story, professional printing, not just a piece of paper. The key elements I remember are that, in Civil War times a fashion had started for units to have an insignia and a 2/13 grunt had happened into the area where another unit was and they all had gold stars as their unit insignia. Our guy asked something like, "Are all you guys Generals" to which they laughed condescendingly and said, "No, that is our unit insignia. What's yours?"
Thinking quickly (that is a direct quote), the soldier slapped his ammo pouch and replied, "Forty rounds in the ammo pouch and twenty in the pocket!" (I remember distinctly thinking at this point, "Then the motto should be SIXTY rounds!"). The rest of the story was that "Jack Black" Logan (I sure remember the nickname) thought that the motto was a "good one" (I'm pretty sure this was the exact phrasing because I didn't think it was a good one at all) and adopted it. None of the versions below mention gold stars.
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2. Paul Lang
To the best of my knowledge the 40 rounds goes back to the Civil War. The 2/13 inf were fighting the southern troops in the South (Miss. or LA I Think). Both sides were completely exhausted. The Southern troops had surrounded the 2/13.They were ready to attack. The 2/13 after taking stock had only 40 rounds of ammo left. The commanding officer then ordered 40 of his best shots to spread around the circle and fire. This resulted in 40 Southern soldiers dying. At this point the Southern officers ordered their soldiers to retread for now. If they had not done this the 2/13 would have been finished. 40 years is a long time to try to remember. I have always been a student of history and do believe most of this is correct.
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3. Jim Williams
I remember when studying for the Soldier of the month thing I had to memorize the history of the motto...unfortunately I don't remember it all.
The situation was when a civil-war era officer asked a 13th infantry soldier about his ammunition level. He answered, "Forty rounds, Sir. Twenty rounds in my cartridge box and twenty in my pocket." This response showed fighting spirit, as the standard ammo load was only twenty.
As you know, they carried rifled muskets, muzzle loading. Their ammunition consisted of a paper cartridge, twisted at one end. Inside was powder for one firing and the ball or minie ball. To load, they reached into their leather cartridge box, took out a cartridge, bit off the twisted top which exposed the powder, dumped it down the barrel, pushed the paper and ball into the barrel, and tamped it down with the rod carried under the barrel. A proficient soldier could load and fire three aimed shots a minute. Look at the unit crest and you will see the black, leather cartridge box at the top between the two evergreen boughs.
The "First at Vicksburg" motto came as a result of being first to breach the massive fortifications after three bloody months of seige warfare. In the final assault, 55% of the 13th fell as casualties.
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4. Off the internet: "The beginnings of heraldry in the Civil War-- Symbols Rally the Spirit"
The story goes that in the fall of l863 the Eleventh and Twelfth Corps under General Hooker were sent to aid in the relief of Chattanooga. It became apparent that the eastern soldiers were better dressed. Corps badges were a novelty in the western units. This caused some sharp words between the men.
One day an enlisted man in the corps of Major General John A. Logan was asked where his corps patch was. Clapping his hand on his cartridge box, he said "Forty Rounds. Can you show me a better one?" Shortly thereafter General Logan issued General Order No. 10 prescribing that the badge for the Fifteenth Corps should be "a miniature cartridge box and above the box will be inscribed the words 'Forty Rounds.'"
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5.
http://cpolrhp.army.mil/scr/Mission3%20_2_.pdf
During the Civil War, for example, certain Union Army corps had adopted distinctive badges. The XV Corps, Maj. Gen. John A. Logan commanding, failed to select one. The story circulated that one of Logan's soldiers, on being asked about his corps badge, replied, "Forty rounds in the cartridge box and twenty in the pocket!" "Black Jack" Logan promptly adopted the saying for the corps badge. Today, the 13th Infantry commemorates its achievements as an element of the XV Corps. The 13th's color contains a crest consisting of a cartridge box bearing the legend "Forty Rounds" "U.S."
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6.
http://www.army.mil/cmh/lineage/OrgHist.htm
During the Civil War, for example, certain Union Army corps had adopted distinctive badges. The XV Corps, Maj. Gen. John A. Logan commanding, failed to select one. The story circulated that one of Logan's soldiers, on being asked about his corps badge, replied, "Forty rounds in the cartridge box and twenty in the pocket!" "Black Jack" Logan promptly adopted the saying for the corps badge. Today, the 13th Infantry commemorates its achievements as an element of the XV Corps. The 13th's color contains a crest consisting of a cartridge box bearing the legend "Forty Rounds" "U.S."
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7. In a biography of William Tecumseh Sherman
http://all-biographies.com/soldiers/william_tecumseh_sherman.htm
"Forty rounds of ammunition in our cartridge-boxes, sixty rounds in our pockets; a march from Memphis to Chattanooga; a battle and pursuit; another march to Knoxville; and victory everywhere," was the proud answer of one of these fifteenth corps soldiers, in reply to the sentinel who asked him where his badge was. And the cartridge-box with forty rounds, thenceforth, became the emblem of the fifteenth corps.
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8. Dave Lubeski
And my recollection of the 40 Rounds thing goes back to the Civil War
(remember the motto: First at Vicksburg?). Apparently the 13th infantry
was running low on ammo during a battle and an officer was going around
to the troops asking what they had left. At one key position he asked
the soldier if he needed any ammo. The soldier pointed to his ammo bags
and said he had 20 rounds in the bag on the left and 20 rounds in the
bag on the right and then snapped a salute saying "I've got 40 rounds
sir."
There's more to it than that. That was just some of the sketchy memory I
have on why it was the salutation. I'm not even sure where I heard that
legend.
By the way, shortly after I got out I happened to be traveling in the
vicinity of Vicksburg and toured the famous civil war battle ground. It
had markers from the various outfits that participated. I found the one
for the 13th Infantry out of Ohio. The date was, indeed, the earliest I
was able to note during the tour, but no marker or commemoration that
they were the first Union troops to arrive for the battle.
Side note:
http://memory.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/r?ammem/ncps:@field(DOCID+@lit(ABQ7578-0151-13))::
…as late as our Civil War forty rounds in the cartridge-box and twenty in
the haversack were a full allowance for a days fighting. (that's all you had time to shoot, it took so long to re-load).
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The following are not 40 rounds stories but are some additional 2/13 history links.
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http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/agency/army/2-13in.htm
http://www.tioh.hqda.pentagon.mil/Inf/13th%20Infantry%20Regiment.htm
http://www.combatindex.com/insignia/army/13_infantry_regiment.html
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